or you could respond to the content.
Sure, Hillary was the victim of some sexism, just as Obama has been the victim of some racism and McCain will be the victim of some ageism.
But that's not what spiked Clinton's chances. Bill Clinton would also have lost this year.
Bill Clinton would also have lost this year.
It's Not Sexism - - - It's Not Sexism.
That it's not sexism is ... laughable. But you're taking after your candidate explaining to people why they feel the way they do.
He's not telling you how to feel, he's stating why he thinks Obama is ahead. By your reasoning, anyone who says (for example) "Hillary may have lost because Mark Penn ran a bad campaign" is also telling you how to feel? I mean, the two have nothing to do with each other.
Taken another way, one could interpret your comment to mean, "I don't care what anyone says, Hillary lost because of sexism, and denying that is sexist in itself."
Being told by a male under age 30 (2.00 / 2) That it's not sexism is ... laughable. But you're taking after your candidate explaining to people why they feel the way they do.
in my book. Condi is a woman. Selebius is a woman. I would not vote for them.
hwo about margaret thatcher?
Sexism comes in many forms. For instance, all those who are voting for Hillary because they want a woman candidate,
So the African-American community is racist for supporting Barack Obama? The AA community should be proud of Barack Obama and I think it is wonderful that they have shown up in record numbers to support him. To me, that is pride, not racism.
But if women for Hillary, they're sexist?
I'm a gay man and I have made no effort to hide the face that Hillary's gender has played a significant role in my decision to support her. Am I sexist? If so, against whom am I discriminating?
At least you see the equivalence. Yeah, a lot of African-Americans are drawn to Obama, and a lot of women are drawn to Clinton, and it's obvious that racial and gender affinity plays a role for both candidates. There is nothing inherently wrong with this. Some Obama supporters are just upset because for months now they've been told that black voters are ONLY voting for Obama because of race, and that's the only reason he's winning. It's an offensive blanket statement that's untrue. Just as it is equally offensive and untrue to say that women voted for Clinton in very high numbers in many states ONLY because she is a woman, and that's the only reason she made it this far.
Yeah, both of our candidates are history-making in their own way, and they represent remarkable racial and gender progress, which has inspired women and African-Americans, in addition to their solid progressive policies. It's a shame that this had led to sites like mydd devolving into back and forth accusations of sexism and racism.
Voting for your own gender or race to break down a barrier, that's fine and anything but racist. BUT, voting for your own race or gender because you hate or fear the other races or gender, that would be racist or sexist.
I don't hold it against women who want a woman president. There have been many silly or offensive arguments made for why we HAD to have Hillary as our nominee, but solidarity between women never sounded silly or offensive to me. If all other things equal, as a liberal man, I would make me feel proud as an American to vote for the first woman for president. However, the issue of the war in Iraq spoiled it for me with Hillary. As it is, since Obama has won the nomination, I am VERY pleased, because he is and was against the war, and because it will make me very proud as an American to vote for the first African-American president.
Fail.
Someone who would never vote for a candidate of a particular sex or race is sexist or racist. Someone who would have a hard time voting for someone of a particular race or sex is racist or sexist. Someone who counts the fact that a candidate is breaking through a glass ceiling as a point in their favor is being anti-sexist or anti-racist.
Okay, then if I cut and paste his diary and posted it, would my gender make it un-laughable.
Seriously, this line of argumentation infuriates me more than anything else. Why don't you just call me a traitor to my sex for supporting Obama? It's the same thing as you're saying here.
This isn't trying to explain to people why they feel they way they do. This is trying to explain why many Obama supporters feel the way the do in hopes that you will realize that to us, this has nothing to do with sexism.
Did he acknowledge this?
I didn't know that, and I've been reading him/her for years now. In fact, I may have assumed from the way he wrote that he was a well-educated older female. Never thought about it that hard.
And Spoon is right. The problem wasn't that Hillary was a victim of sexism. The problem was elsewhere. It was the war, it was her consultants, it was the strategy, it was a number of other things I might document elsewhere that suggest they just did not get what we have all been upset about for the past five years. You can't run what is (basically) a "reelection" campaign in a year when the people want to throw out all the rascals.
I TR'd this comment.
Your diary is a piece of shit. Barack Obama would be ashamed to read it.
That is an awful thing to say and do. The poster was merely saying what many election officials are saying: HRC ran a strong campaign BUT she didn't do some important things. She didn't realize the move the the left of the activist base and address the role of the war vote. Her advisers admitted that her campaign had no plan after 5 Feb. She burned through cash too quickly and listened to a few very bad advisers such as Mark Penn and Patti Solis Doyle. (Staff at the top is one of the biggest mistakes one can make in a campaign).
The poster was merely saying that these things are far more likely to be the reason that she has lost the primary.
But getting so insulting because the poster attributed her loss to her positions and organization is awful troll like behavior on your part. Stop this. It is time to see the end of this damned civil war. We are one party and that was unacceptable.
I don't know where the words "election officials" came from. Maybe I meant commentators and or writers/ columnists.
COLUMN 1
Progresssive ---- her not him
Bring new voters-----her and him
Howard Dean ----Huh
Ground-up campaign ----he has run the tight centralized campaign and it will be more in the genreal
Rejection of lobbyists ----- a facade, a gimmick...so they bundle money for him
50-state strategy ----- in the general...you really think ...esp. if he takes federal money and no 527's ...no it won't happen ---- Establishing new coalitions ----so does she, Hispanics, unmarried women, and in certain swing states she brings young voters
Downballot as important as top-of-ballot ---- in Texas Obama voters were only thee for him, they didn't vote for downballot races while places she was strong, they did. You see Democrats vote for Demcorats...Indepenents and Republicans who have only crossed over for the day don't care so much about the party
Unapologetically espousing progressive principles and taking with you the voters that will come your way ----this is either just wish fulfillment on your part, rationalization or bs. Hillary not only talks more about being a progressive, she uses the word more and she used the word Democrat more. Obama made his mark by dissing progressive infrastructure form parts of the abortion rights agenda to Reagan to blogs.....
Looking tough on national security by not voting with Republicans ----like what...he can't vote when he's conveniently not there to vote...there is
Lookiing beyond the social issue fights that have characterized politics lo these many years ---WTF does that mean...women who care about abortion and gay people fall in line and shut up while I ignore you and your concerns.
COLUMN 2
Bill Clinton --- Tom Daschle .... a man with the courage of a caterpillar. Barack Obama is the 2008 version of Bill Clinton in 1992.
DLC Democrat --- that's actually where his policy positions really are
Mark Penn ---- okay you're right
Terry McAuliffe ----you mean the man who told Tim Russert from Jan 20, 2001 on that George bush ws illegitimate and Al gore won. No more partisan a Democrat is there than Terry McAuliffe. Tom Daschle just agreed with Timmeh. Also the The man who got the DNC out of debt, built a huge warchest and built its own building.....
James Carville ---- if he's for Obama you'll be grateful Triangulation ----- you mean what Obama does as well
"big/swing state strategy" ---Obama is just a map changer not expander...it wil be much the same map as before
Top-down campaign ---Have you been reading the consolidation series in Open Left?....
Keep the old coalition alive at all costs and win back the Reagan "Dems" by magic pixie dust establishment oriented ---- yes let's throw out working people..let's throw that part of the party and the people it represents upon the pyres
"the White House is all that matters" ----you are mischaracterizing her position
Trying to look tough on national security by voting with Republicans to invade other countries to prove your bone fides ---- Obama agrees with her on Iran....
And continuing the same squares/hippies proxy fights that have been taking place since the late 60's. ----yes let's throw boomers the way Eskimos used t treat their older members.
It is also the height of ostrichism to think that these things are going away. That fight comes from the other side....and the sexism that you are unaware of has defined her from the begginng of her time on the national stage. Hillary was a target of the right because she was a exemplar of how far woman had come and could go.
So it was sexism from the begining...and it's sexism that distorted the view of her and it's sexism that continues when you ascribe all that's bad to her and don't begin to give her credit for what she has done and what she stands for....
Spoon has been hard to read since he changed his focus several months ago. I used to enjoy some of his postings but this one just proves that he is simply not paying attention...but he is talking anyway. Sorry to see that.
But very happy to see you, again. Thank you, from those who haven't the heart, for splainin' it out for him so well.
